RE: [HAPS-L] A&P dual enrollment

[WCaldecutt@xxxxxxxx]

Ditto for us at Polk Community College, Florida.  We also have a charter high school on campus.  Some of my best A&P students have been from that program... in fact, one of them is a paid tutor for our department.

I think the issue isn't whether or not someone is over 18 years old.  The issue is whether the student is prepared, regardless.  This goes for all students entering college, and I think it's a big problem since I commonly have a 40-50% drop rate that I blame on unprepared enrollment.

--Bill Caldecutt

________________________________

From: HAPS-L-owner@xxxxxxxxxxx on behalf of Nichols, Linda
Sent: Thu 1/5/2006 1:51 PM
To: HAPS-L@xxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [HAPS-L] A&P dual enrollment



Our situation is similar to what Janice describes below except the dual enrolled students only take the A&P college courses on our campus.  In fact we have a dual enrolled high school on campus where students take high school and college courses depending on their test scores. Therefore there is no pressure from coaches and parents.  



Linda R. Nichols

Chair of Sciences for Health Programs

Co-Director of Biotechnology

Santa Fe Community College

Gainesville, FL  32606

352-395-5708



-----Original Message-----
From: HAPS-L-owner@xxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:HAPS-L-owner@xxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of SMITH, JANICE
Sent: Thursday, January 05, 2006 1:20 PM
To: HAPS-L@xxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: RE: [HAPS-L] A&P dual enrollment





Some advanced high school students can handle the curriculum. Those not capable can probably be screened out by some placement test.  TX requires all students entering college to have certain high school exit test or SAT or ACT scores, or they must take the state entrance exam. Students with poor scores must take developmental classes.  We don't let anyone required to take remediation take dual credit courses. 



There are other problems to consider. Our college offers a variety of dual credit courses and we've seen the following problems:



administrators and coaches coercing dual credit teachers to inflate grades for certain students who aren't passing

parents demanding extra credit and / or softer curricula

inadequate time devoted to real labs vs. coloring book or other labs



If the students take the course on the college campus, there are fewer of these, but the parent problem still persists. In fact, we are seeing more and more parents of true college age students that just won't let their kids fly on their own. Very annoying. Thank goodness for FERPA!



Janice Yoder Smith



-----Original Message-----

From: HAPS-L-owner@xxxxxxxxxxx on behalf of Peter Zao

Sent: Thu 1/5/2006 12:03 PM

To: HAPS-L@xxxxxxxxxxx

Subject: [HAPS-L] A&P dual enrollment



Is there a HAPS position on dual enrollment (high school students

enrolled in college classes)?  High schools in our area would like to

teach A&P at the high schools and award those high school students

college credit for taking A&P.  



My personal opinion is that high school students have not developed the

neural connections necessary to perform well in second-year science

(unless of course the content is watered down to the high school level).

I've had high school students attempt A&P and rarely are they

successful. 



Peter Zao

Biology Department

North Idaho College

Coeur d'Alene, ID  83814

(208).769.3473

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